Board index

My Home Page

PilotOdyssey.com By hoser...


PilotOdyssey.com Chat Room

PilotOdyssey.com Photo Album

* Login   * Register * FAQ
http://www.pilotodyssey.com/PO/adm/images/imagemenu/smiley_cool.png PilotOdyssey.com Chat    http://www.pilotodyssey.com/PO/adm/images/imagemenu/find.png PilotOdyssey.com Google Search    http://www.pilotodyssey.com/PO/adm/images/imagemenu/emoticon_tongue.png FL400 Parts    http://www.pilotodyssey.com/PO/adm/images/imagemenu/emoticon_grin.png FL350 Parts    http://www.pilotodyssey.com/PO/adm/images/imagemenu/emoticon_evilgrin.png FL250 Parts    http://www.pilotodyssey.com/PO/adm/images/imagemenu/emoticon_unhappy.png Admin Email   
It is currently Sat Apr 27, 2024 7:13 pm

All times are UTC - 5 hours [ DST ]




Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 36 posts ]  Go to page 1, 2  Next
Author Message
PostPosted: Tue Apr 01, 2008 3:34 am 
Offline

Joined: Thu Mar 01, 2007 2:52 am
Posts: 109
After getting my Oddy all set up, I can no longer operate it due to a hand injury. It is up for sale here and on P-O

But - I did purchase Jerrys B's Stadium Lite! It is a FL350r powered, H&R chassis, Coleman trans, works shocks, Full A-arm ex Mickey Thompson series car. And since it has foot controls, I can go racing again.

While it is 95% complete, it does need some work. Things like wiring, hoses will be redone. Shocks will be rebuilt and resevoirs added. Has a motor (( Internal Combustion Engine ? )) issue - Jerry had cylinder resleved and it will not longer rev up. (that one has all the experts puzzled). After a good prep it will be racing again in Elsinore in May.

Here are a few pics.


Attachments:
MISC+PICS+(72).jpg
MISC+PICS+(72).jpg [ 44.46 KiB | Viewed 1509 times ]
Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Tue Apr 01, 2008 7:23 am 
Offline

Joined: Sun Jul 16, 2006 8:46 am
Posts: 5257
Location: Seguin, TX (near San Antonio)
I have seen the car last year when they were just breaking it in! Looked like a well built car! It had a short day but still looked like a well built car. I am glad it went to a good home!!!


Top
 Profile E-mail  
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Tue Apr 01, 2008 7:29 am 
Offline

Joined: Mon Dec 15, 2003 2:40 pm
Posts: 22516
Location: Chicago
Post some detail pics of the cylinder maybe we can figure it out, or send me the cylinder and head for a CSI.


Top
 Profile E-mail  
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Tue Apr 01, 2008 3:18 pm 
Offline

Joined: Thu Mar 01, 2007 2:52 am
Posts: 109
It was / will be a sweet car. I have raced against it at Glen Helen - and when it was running right it was fast and handled great.
Here is what I know about the motor (( Internal Combustion Engine ? )).
They had the cylinder re-sleeved by a reputable guy. New piston & rings. Put it all back together and it would not rev up. It has been back apart a few times, ports check, etc. Still no rev. Differnt jetting & carb tried - same issue. And that is the way I got it.
It will start right up and idle fine. But will not rev up.
Just did all the basic troubleshooting - swapped out the CDI (Capacitor Discharge Ignition), coil. Checked the reeds, exhaust not plugged, carb okay, float level okay. Filter okay. Timing is spot on. Does not appear to be electrical in nature.
It will rev to about 4000 and then '4 stroke' Blows raw fuel out the exhaust, plug is wet but not black. Compression is 85psi - but it has never really been broken it, so not sure if that is the issue.
My guess is the rings did not seal, or the port are not correct. Gonna try some new gas tonite, and then pull the top end.
Will post up what I find...


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Tue Apr 01, 2008 3:46 pm 
Offline

Joined: Mon Dec 15, 2003 2:40 pm
Posts: 22516
Location: Chicago
blue coyote wrote:
It was / will be a sweet car. I have raced against it at Glen Helen - and when it was running right it was fast and handled great.
Here is what I know about the motor (( Internal Combustion Engine ? )).
They had the cylinder re-sleeved by a reputable guy. New piston & rings. Put it all back together and it would not rev up. It has been back apart a few times, ports check, etc. Still no rev. Differnt jetting & carb tried - same issue. And that is the way I got it.
It will start right up and idle fine. But will not rev up.
Just did all the basic troubleshooting - swapped out the CDI (Capacitor Discharge Ignition), coil. Checked the reeds, exhaust not plugged, carb okay, float level okay. Filter okay. Timing is spot on. Does not appear to be electrical in nature.
It will rev to about 4000 and then '4 stroke' Blows raw fuel out the exhaust, plug is wet but not black. Compression is 85psi - but it has never really been broken it, so not sure if that is the issue.
My guess is the rings did not seal, or the port are not correct. Gonna try some new gas tonite, and then pull the top end.
Will post up what I find...


If its blowing raw fuel then it is either dumping too much fuel into the Engine or your losing spark, fast easy check would be to close the plug gap, weak spark will snuff the spark as RPM's increase, closing the gap will help with that problem, if it makes no difference with plug gap then go into the carb something is not right, choke not seating (adjust) wrong jets, wrong float settings, ruptured diaphragm in the fuel pump.

Check compression will tell you how the rings are seating.

Tripple verify exhaust is not plugged

Look into exhaust to verify piston was not installed backwards.

Check reeds, verify reed cage is installed.


Top
 Profile E-mail  
 
 Post subject: Photos
PostPosted: Mon Apr 07, 2008 12:05 pm 
Offline

Joined: Thu Mar 01, 2007 2:52 am
Posts: 109
Here are some photos of it with the side panels off.


Attachments:
IMG_0299.JPG
IMG_0299.JPG [ 67.67 KiB | Viewed 2131 times ]
IMG_0300.JPG
IMG_0300.JPG [ 58.3 KiB | Viewed 2131 times ]
IMG_0296.JPG
IMG_0296.JPG [ 68.71 KiB | Viewed 2130 times ]
Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: More pics
PostPosted: Mon Apr 07, 2008 12:09 pm 
Offline

Joined: Thu Mar 01, 2007 2:52 am
Posts: 109
Here are some of the Engine - water cooled head and jug. Unknown manufacture
Transmission is engraved COLEMAN PRODUCTS. It is a FNR box with a center differential, uses what look like VW axles and related parts.


Attachments:
IMG_0297.JPG
IMG_0297.JPG [ 68.51 KiB | Viewed 2129 times ]
IMG_0298.JPG
IMG_0298.JPG [ 56.96 KiB | Viewed 2129 times ]
Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Mon Apr 07, 2008 4:24 pm 
Offline

Joined: Mon Dec 15, 2003 2:40 pm
Posts: 22516
Location: Chicago
Can you take more detail pics of the trans, any info on it?

Your going to cover that gauze filter with a foam filter? UNI can make you one to fit if they don't already.


Top
 Profile E-mail  
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Mon Apr 07, 2008 8:29 pm 
Offline

Joined: Fri Feb 29, 2008 1:51 am
Posts: 2703
Location: Upland, Ca
That thing looks awsome. Wheres the fuel cell/tank go???????????


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Mon Apr 07, 2008 11:16 pm 
Offline

Joined: Sun Jul 16, 2006 8:46 am
Posts: 5257
Location: Seguin, TX (near San Antonio)
Could it be the pipe that is making the thing run rough? now with fresh sleve the pipe doesn't match up??? just a newbie thought???


Top
 Profile E-mail  
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Thu May 15, 2008 12:35 am 
Offline

Joined: Fri Feb 29, 2008 1:51 am
Posts: 2703
Location: Upland, Ca
Any new updates on the car? And your troubleshooting?


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Thu May 15, 2008 1:38 am 
Offline

Joined: Thu Mar 01, 2007 2:52 am
Posts: 109
Been too busy with Trophy Kart events to even touch this project. Hopefully this weekend will allow me some shop time.

Fuel cell - about 3 gallons - goes behind the seat. Still need to get some fittings to finish re-installing it.

Pipe - while it is but axx ugly, who knows. However the exhaust ports do line up. I do have a new nickle plated DG pipe that I may modify if the motor (( Internal Combustion Engine ? )) is good. My thinking is who ever sleeved it cut the exhuast port to high, killing the compression. But I cannot get this confirmed. At this point I am gonna throw in new seals / gaskets / rings / o-rings and see if it will run up. The piston was installed backwards, but not sure if that was the issue.

More issues - the PowerBloc clutch is cracked. But I have an old stocker that I will use for now, just to see if the motor (( Internal Combustion Engine ? )) will run up. No use spending $ if the motor (( Internal Combustion Engine ? )) is AFU.

Input bearing on the Coleman trans is loose - gonna pull the trans this weekend and get some bearing and seal #'s to overhaul it.

If the FL350 motor (( Internal Combustion Engine ? )) will not run up, and it needs a to be re-re-re-sleeved I may just install a 600 +/- 4 stroke. There is plenty of room for just about any bike / quad motor (( Internal Combustion Engine ? )). I have heard there are some that use a CVT set up.

My goal is to make the M4SX Race in Elsinore on June 14.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Thu May 15, 2008 7:30 am 
Offline

Joined: Mon Dec 15, 2003 2:40 pm
Posts: 22516
Location: Chicago
blue coyote wrote:
Been too busy with Trophy Kart events to even touch this project. Hopefully this weekend will allow me some shop time.

Fuel cell - about 3 gallons - goes behind the seat. Still need to get some fittings to finish re-installing it.

Pipe - while it is but axx ugly, who knows. However the exhaust ports do line up. I do have a new nickle plated DG pipe that I may modify if the motor (( Internal Combustion Engine ? )) is good. My thinking is who ever sleeved it cut the exhuast port to high, killing the compression. But I cannot get this confirmed. At this point I am gonna throw in new seals / gaskets / rings / o-rings and see if it will run up. The piston was installed backwards, but not sure if that was the issue.

More issues - the PowerBloc clutch is cracked. But I have an old stocker that I will use for now, just to see if the motor (( Internal Combustion Engine ? )) will run up. No use spending $ if the motor (( Internal Combustion Engine ? )) is AFU.

Input bearing on the Coleman trans is loose - gonna pull the trans this weekend and get some bearing and seal #'s to overhaul it.

If the FL350 motor (( Internal Combustion Engine ? )) will not run up, and it needs a to be re-re-re-sleeved I may just install a 600 +/- 4 stroke. There is plenty of room for just about any bike / quad motor (( Internal Combustion Engine ? )). I have heard there are some that use a CVT set up.

My goal is to make the M4SX Race in Elsinore on June 14.


You can not always go by the static compression measurement, when the Engine gets on the pipe it will run, if its a full race Engine chances are the exhaust port has been raised, can you accurately measure from the top of the exhaust to the top of the cylinder I have one 350 cylinder we can compare to others here have cylinders also. How about some detail pics of the porting I would like to see if their was any exotic work done like welding or adding extra ports.

I would stick with the pipe that came with the Engine chances are it was design for that porting, going to another pipe might kill the power, going to a stock clutch with a full mod Engine it wont run right, you wont be happy, it will bog for sure, I would get the power bloc and duplicate the settings your currently using assuming it was setup right.

Make sure their is no restrictions inside the pipe and silencer, mouse nest or wasp nest.


Top
 Profile E-mail  
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sun May 18, 2008 12:34 am 
Offline

Joined: Thu Mar 01, 2007 2:52 am
Posts: 109
More progress
Ordered the Engine seals, gaskets, bearings, rings today. Will be in next week.

Pulled the trans out as some of the seals were leaking, the input shaft was very loose, and it was hard to shift. Tore it down of inspection - bearings are fair, but will replace them all anyway. Seals leaking, but again easy to replace. The shift linkage was not adjusted properly at some point - the input drive gear is about gone on one side. Was able to get some info on who made it - hopefully they can tell me where the gears came from. The look like a production part - not custom made. Photos of the trans coming.

Pipe - not sure if the pipe on it was the original. But I do have a DG hi-rev pipe that I can use.
Clutch - if the motor (( Internal Combustion Engine ? )) revs up than I will get another PowerBloc - just hard to spend $$ until I know it runs.

Cylinder:
Here are some photos of the ports before finishing up the port matching
** More before photos added 05/28**


Attachments:
IMG_0023.JPG
IMG_0023.JPG [ 56.89 KiB | Viewed 2052 times ]
IMG_0013.JPG
IMG_0013.JPG [ 37.88 KiB | Viewed 1970 times ]
IMG_0017.JPG
IMG_0017.JPG [ 42.84 KiB | Viewed 1970 times ]
IMG_0018.JPG
IMG_0018.JPG [ 42.85 KiB | Viewed 1970 times ]
Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Weekend progress
PostPosted: Tue May 27, 2008 10:52 am 
Offline

Joined: Thu Mar 01, 2007 2:52 am
Posts: 109
Got alot done this Memorial Day weekend:

Trans - picked up the new bearings / seals. Filed the 'dog ears' off the gears. Trans is now back together - still have to shim the drive flanges, install drains plugs and add oil.

motor (( Internal Combustion Engine ? )) - most of the parts arrived. Installed all new lower end bearings and seals. Carefully cleaned the center gastket and reused. Fabricated a new locking tab out of 304 stainless. Honed the cylinder along with finishing the port matching of the sleeve. Did the bridge releif, piston holes, rediused everything. Still waiting on the base and head gaskets to complete the motor (( Internal Combustion Engine ? )). Still need head and cover O-rings.

Chassis - Cleaned and repacked the rear wheel bearings. fronts are junked. Cleaned and re-lubed the Wright rack. Checked the VW based rear axle CV's and reclamped the boots. Power washed the entire car.

Still to do:
Fuel cell - decided not to use the one that came with the car - do not trust the remote fill set up. Going to use a 3gl Jaz with lever cap - will be a bit harder to fill, but much safer.
motor (( Internal Combustion Engine ? )) mounts - need to find some urethane bushings for that
Clutch - the Powerbloc clutch is cracked
Window nets - might have to go custom
Parts - more bearings / seals / clips / zirks / dzus / bolts / etc.

19 days to go...

Pics of the trans up tonite.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Tue May 27, 2008 11:03 am 
Offline

Joined: Mon Dec 15, 2003 2:40 pm
Posts: 22516
Location: Chicago
Post a pic of the crack please.


Top
 Profile E-mail  
 
 Post subject: Tranny exposed
PostPosted: Wed May 28, 2008 9:12 pm 
Offline

Joined: Thu Mar 01, 2007 2:52 am
Posts: 109
Hear are photos of the trans. Made by Coleman - no longer in business. All billet case, Baker diff that uses VW parts, no idea on the gears.
Just installed all new bearings / seals. The input drive gear has had the damaged "dog ears" filed off and flipped over, so the weak side will now be reverse.


Attachments:
IMG_0052.JPG
IMG_0052.JPG [ 54.44 KiB | Viewed 1963 times ]
IMG_0051.JPG
IMG_0051.JPG [ 56.62 KiB | Viewed 1963 times ]
IMG_0046.JPG
IMG_0046.JPG [ 60.31 KiB | Viewed 1963 times ]
Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Broken Powerbloc clutch
PostPosted: Wed May 28, 2008 9:23 pm 
Offline

Joined: Thu Mar 01, 2007 2:52 am
Posts: 109
Found this nasty crack in the Powerbloc clutch. Not sure if it was caused by prying or impact with something. Either way it is now junk.


Attachments:
IMG_0053.JPG
IMG_0053.JPG [ 45.6 KiB | Viewed 1962 times ]
IMG_0054.JPG
IMG_0054.JPG [ 69.73 KiB | Viewed 1962 times ]
Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Wed May 28, 2008 9:28 pm 
Offline

Joined: Sat Aug 12, 2006 9:02 pm
Posts: 533
Location: Bellevue WA I OWE Hoser $300.00
why is it junk? cant u have it welded?


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: After porting
PostPosted: Wed May 28, 2008 9:35 pm 
Offline

Joined: Thu Mar 01, 2007 2:52 am
Posts: 109
The intake port needed the most work. All the others only needed very minor touch up , radiusing. On the intake I radiused the uppper bridge slightly, and matched the wide side ports to the casting.

Some other CSI - the 'squish' with original 3 piece head gasket was .060. From reading here it needs to be in the .036 to .042 range. My plan is to run av gas so the compression can be higher.


Attachments:
IMG_0058.JPG
IMG_0058.JPG [ 35.77 KiB | Viewed 1955 times ]
Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Wed May 28, 2008 9:38 pm 
Offline

Joined: Thu Mar 01, 2007 2:52 am
Posts: 109
Twilight wrote:
why is it junk? cant u have it welded?


The cintrifugal forces at 8000 rpm would make in highly prone to failure and extremely unsafe.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: After porting
PostPosted: Wed May 28, 2008 9:52 pm 
Offline

Joined: Mon Dec 15, 2003 2:40 pm
Posts: 22516
Location: Chicago
blue coyote wrote:
The intake port needed the most work. All the others only needed very minor touch up , radiusing. On the intake I radiused the uppper bridge slightly, and matched the wide side ports to the casting.

Some other CSI - the 'squish' with original 3 piece head gasket was .060. From reading here it needs to be in the .036 to .042 range. My plan is to run av gas so the compression can be higher.


Can you roll the piston to BDC and take a pic of the intake?


Top
 Profile E-mail  
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Tue Jun 10, 2008 3:19 am 
Offline

Joined: Thu Mar 01, 2007 2:52 am
Posts: 109
Been very busy on this - here is a progress report
Trans is back in and shimmed. Had to fab shim the outer CV's to get it all aligned witn no bind.

Engine is back in. All new urethane motor (( Internal Combustion Engine ? )) mounts fabbed up. Head squish set to .036 using the two thin gaskets. (it was .060) Case breather installed. New head Orings. had to sand down the oring groove to get the head low enought to get the squish down.

Took clutch down to Harold a HRD. In the long run it was more cost effective to replace the entire clutch. New Powerbloc installed w/ new belt.

Modified a FL350 DJ pipe (turned the elbows 180* to make it all work.

Picked up a 3gl Jaz fuel cell. Got it all plumbed in.
Patched the cell and filre walls. Replaced all the Engine wiring / connectors.

Shock seal kits on order. Just need big window nets and new seat belts (may jut borrow them from the 7s truck for now), install the seat, side panels, tires and it is time for a test run.....

Started it up tonite - fired after about 2 seconds. Sounds great!

BUT IT WILL STILL NOT REV UP! Same crap as before - starst 4 stroking at about 3500 rpm. Below that it is snappy and crisp, above that it just will not run.
Double checked everything - same problem.
It has new gas (Chevron 91, Honda HP2 @ 32:1.
Compression on the gauge reads 90psi - but I do not believe the gauge, as this motor (( Internal Combustion Engine ? )) is very hard to turn over. Much more compression than my FL350 had.
Wiring / coil / plug all good. Timing on, pick up at spec, nice spark.
Tried unhooking the fuel, letting the Engine run out of fuel, hoping would lean out and rev up. Never did. Loosened the carb boot (intentional air leak causing a lean out, no change)
So WFT is up with this motor (( Internal Combustion Engine ? )). Open to all ideas - as had planned to race in on Saturday...


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Tue Jun 10, 2008 7:40 am 
Offline

Joined: Mon Dec 15, 2003 2:40 pm
Posts: 22516
Location: Chicago
It sounds like the reverse rev limiter is kicking in.

Exhaust not plugged?

Try it without a silencer?


Top
 Profile E-mail  
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Tue Jun 10, 2008 10:21 am 
Offline

Joined: Thu Mar 01, 2007 2:52 am
Posts: 109
hoser wrote:
It sounds like the reverse rev limiter is kicking in.

Exhaust not plugged?

Try it without a silencer?


Thought that too - however the grey wire is not conneced and is capped. From the wiring diagram the reverse switch grounds the grey wire, cutting the RPM. Unless the CDI (Capacitor Discharge Ignition) is bad. But it had the same symptom with another CDI (Capacitor Discharge Ignition)

Exhaust not plugged - DG pipe. Silener is wide open - straight thru. Will pull it off just the same

Would worn reeds cause this? The leafs are not sitting tight against each other at rest - maybe about .007 gap.

Less than 100 hours before the green flag...


Top
 Profile  
 
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 36 posts ]  Go to page 1, 2  Next

All times are UTC - 5 hours [ DST ]


Who is online

Registered users: Bing [Bot], Google [Bot]


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot post attachments in this forum

Jump to:  
cron
Powered by phpBB® Forum Software © phpBB Group