Mr Bishop-
This reply is in regards to a posting that was emailed to me today:
http://www.quickieracing.com/forums/ind ... topic=60.0

I wish to reply to you in regard to your slanderous and untruths involving myself, my many purchases from you and your company.I have indeed purchased 2 that's correct 2 kits-1 from you and 1 from Randy at Odysseysalvage.My first purchase from you was for 1 of your kit that was advertised by you on your site.Prior to my purchase of that kit I had done several transactions with you and had no issues-I had purchased your water cooled heads, had motor (( Internal Combustion Engine ? )) work performed by you(or that's at least what I was told)bought shaved heads, gaskets, parts and associated items from you and there was never any issues.NEVER did you mention the name Hoser or accuse myself of being a "hoserite" when those transaction were processed between us, for thousands of dollars might I add.
When I transacted a purchase from you for 1 of your kits, never again was the Hoserite name or affiliation inplyed or given by you-I had no knowledge of who Hoser was or anybody in the community here, I was a newbie looking to involve myself into this great hobby, and you allowed me to by accepting my money for purchases it seemed.I have every email between us for my transaction for the kit and there was never a BETA aggreement between us, and as for a discount you implyed was given to me by you-I paid full purchase price for the kit, if any said discounts where given to me by you it was in regards to late shipping and backlogs due to your powdercoater(that ring a bell??)not being able to powdercoat the arms in my color I specifed.

Quote from your posting:

When first producing my FL350 A-arm kit, Greg who goes by Mudbogger, thebogger, joeyg and other screen names wished to be the first on to get one. I told him he would be a Beta tester and as such would get a discounted price on the kit and on the Bilstein shocks he got to use with the kit. As part of that beta agreement, he was to convey any issues to me and only me so I could remedy them not only for him, but for anyone purchasing the kit later

Proof this to me-I never told or agreed that I would tell you only you any issues with the kit-as any consumer that purchases a kit they will/can report any issues as to installations, testing of the product to the manufacterer of it -if that's your BETA agreement you say you had with me that's paper thin and wouldn't stand up in any court of law(just got of the phone with my attorney)I paid full purchase price for the Billstiens shocks at that time and after my purchase I had to wait an extra time frame for there arrival to me.I have the emails to prove it as well Mr Bishop.

Quote from you :

." He told me about a few issues, the ones that really did need addressing by me".

So if indeed I did tell you issues, then how did I break the agreement between the parties that you state we had?double jeopardy Mr Bishop.I informed you-not Hoser or others- on numerous issues with the kit, which it seems by the postings by "turbotexas" HAVE NOT BEEN ADDRESSED to date-like the installation video for instance.More untruth by yourself IMO in your postings.

Quote :
"As it turned out, Mudbogger was an undercover hoserite (bashes others based on the personal vendetta of hoser). He only told things he did not like to hoser. hoser then used that information in an effort to discredit me in a post on Mike's board. As such Mudbogger is liable for the discount he received on the kit since he violated the beta agreement".

IF ANYBODY COULD EXPLAIN this to me please do, I am liable for the discount ?I purchased a 2700+ kit for "kelly" to bash you??, that's just plain ignorant!!!my goodness, you really think I or someone else would spend that kind of money for Kelly to bash you?would somebody do such a thing??I am sorry but mabye you can read minds as well as design/fab kits too?How does 1 make claims like this without facts?I did not even know Kelly at the time of my first purchase and his knowledge of your kit can years later when your kit can under scrutiny on the old PO board, I bought the kit for me nobody else-that statement is false and misleading.I am very friendly with Kelly yes, but at time of purchase I didn't know Kelly from the milkman(and to date I have never even met Kelly face to face).

Quote:
"Mudbogger continued as an undercover hoserite by posting negative comments, but pretending he was doing so just as an innocent observation. He was later exposed to the world as being a hoserite when he tried to bash me about selling PWK carbs on eBay for more than another website even though I sold them on my website for less. The community chastised him and he reverted to the dark little hole that is hoser's board".

Mr Bishop,Mission Impossible starred Tom Cruise not Mudbogger!!Undercover hoserite????Later exposed to the world?What wrong with being friendly with Kelly?Holy mackeral Batman!!! I posted comments on your kit years later from my personal findings-not for him or anybody else and kept my mouth shut about it for years-you should IMO thank me for that.If my memory serves me correct my initial postings about the kit were in referrance to the frame section not fitting properly on frame rails that are bent which I was yes chastised for by your friends/partners on the old board.You never told me when purchased to measure my frame rails, you never instructed anything on it to be honest and if my lawyer will allow me I'll post the instructional video that you sent me which IMO was totally lacking in many aspects(which I see hasn't changed in the years according to Turbotexas postings)btw THE CARB ISSUE was correct, you could buy it for cheaper and that's your opinion-not mine still to this day-you are still angered at a consumer posting options for others that's unspeakable if you truly love the hobby.You really shouldn't post such untruths please Mr Bishop.

In referrance to the second kit you speak of in your posting-as stated to you that kit was for my brother in law-the kit was purchased through our families Payapl account which had my fathers name on it at that time.My brother in law was overseas at the time of purchase and didn't/couldn't speak with you about the kit at that time which was explained via email to you.If you had a reservation that the kit was going to me, you could have just stated you wished not to sell it-listed the reasons and been done with the transaction, but you didn't-you fail to mention in your posting you held my brother in laws money for 2 months and didnt refund the money till after email/agreement in principle between the parties.I am going to limit the discussion on this -my brother in law had the issues not me.As to purchasing a kit from Randy-we and he had no issues with that sale-why should you???.Have you seen a posting from me "bashing" you for that kit?I guess I purchased that kit for Hoser too correct Mr Bishop? that kit has been on my brother in laws 350 for months and there has been not 1 posting FROM ME- negative or positive on it, but you stated earleir that I purchsed my first kit with the intentions of only discrediting you-untruthful and slanderous again Mr Bishop.TO DATE HAVE YOU SEEN ANYTHING FROM MYSELF IN REGARDS TO THE SECOND KIT FROM YOU?Do you think this second kit was purchased as well to discredit you Mr Bishop or for purposes of allowing Hoser to discredit you and your kit???-if so where are the slanderous,discrediting postings on it ??Show them please- post them here-there arent plain and simple.Again, mistruths you post about myself Mr Bishop.Far to common IMO.

Quote:
I found out a few months later that Mudbogger then contacted Randy at Odyssey Salvage to buy a kit. Randy had a used kit in stock or would have to drop ship a kit from me. If drop shipped, I would have told Randy to refund his money. Mudbogger bought the used kit. Randy said he was going to install the kit on his own machine so would have to buy another if Mudbogger bought the used one. Therefore, he could not reduce the price. The reason Randy had a used kit was he bought a machine with it installed that was used. Randy parted it out. The kit had been purchased direct from chucklenuts at aftershot motorspurts as a blem. It was made during a period when the jigs were being redone and required more prying to install. So Mudbogger paid full price for a used blem kit

And your point is what?You wouldn't sell it so why not ask Randy?He doesnt deserve to make a few dollars on a sale Mr Bishop?I am not posting anything about the price-my brother in law ordered and got what he paid for -you are rambling on for some reason on issues not prevailing to the topic here!!what is the point?Because Turbotexas got a kit that's inferior by his standards means that for some reason mine was is 2?I would purchase anything from Randy at anytime and would rather buy from him than many other vendors-he stands by what he sells.On that note, it is a shame that I see Randys name being dropped by you constantly in these postings that's not fair to him and you for 1 should be ashamed and humiliated for that kind of action against him IMO.In no way shape of form did I ask for a discount from Randy and IMO the "BLEM" kit my brother in law purchased was far better than my original kit to be honest-your point is well taken though it is easier for you to let all know that my kit was a blem so if for some reason I do post a negative finding it can be considered by the consumer as par for the coarse due to it's "blem' status-thats funny because when sold by Randy the word "BLEM" WAS NEVER USED BY AT ALL-in fact the kit was used by him on his sons 350 at time of purchase-so you have just admitted you sold your own distributor a "blem" kit, that mighty nice of you I must add.

In passing-the posting by yourself is slanderous, misleading and untruthful in many ways.Being friendly with Hoser and stating terms like "darkside" are ploys and tactics-there is nothing wrong with associatING with the guy or his board IMO.There is some truth to YOUR POSTING as such: I made many purchases from you for thousands of dollars-you may wish to remind yourself of that-it may come in handy for future referrances.Thank you for your time in regards to this matter Mr Bishop.

WOW???

GOOD GRIEF why is all the drama required when a guy ask for some simple help, Steve must have lost his mind, this is minor customer support, why does someone have to kiss a vendors ass and butter him up just to get a few questions answered.


You can see Turbo is in panic mode trying to get his 350 ready (been their done that) for this weeks Oregon ride trip, he is outside working in the heat and humidity of Texas with no real instructions you can read in his first post he is sweaty and frustrated, sure Turbo wants a instant answer its human nature, he is excited about his new enhancement to his toy Dee Dee Dee, this is the information age, cant get help by phone then post the questions on the boards,after all historically (FACT) that's where you can find Steve any hour of the day or night he is trolling the Pilot Odyssey boards looking for a sale, this is no secret, look around, we did, we seen his postings all over the web in the same time frame.

Steve must have changed he must no longer have his cell phone strapped to his body 24/7 I take it others must be having problems contacting him also.

As this has played out it looks to me that it would require less time and thought to answer the original questions asked during the install than he has spent playing the blame game, typing out baseless rants that have nothing to do with the questions asked.

This is another missed opportunity for Steve to plug his products in public, a huge opportunity to be proud of what he designed and built, the perfect audience, he could have made a big online collaboration tutorial out of Turbotexas basic questions about installing the kit, he could have easily posted a bunch of detailed pictures of his previous installations, he could have easily built up the confidence of future customers, improved the chances of future sales, flaunted his customer service, had the perfect, complete documentation thread he could have pointed others to in the future, used that informative thread as a FAQ at the time of his future sales, "before you buy read this so you will know what is required to install my product, if you still have questions or problems call me ASAP" reduced 90% of future installations questions, build the confidence of the installer and potential customers. But what was the replies Turbo received, go to my old board and read that train wreck, man you BLEW it big time Steve, now people think your a mutt, no doubt rather than get into recovery mode you will start ranting about "hoserites"

Since he has coin the phrase "Hoserite" lets look at this a minute, by reading some of the emails I recieve some get the impression this is a bad thing, its a good thing, look around you look at what you get when you come to my place looking for Pilot Odyssey knowledge, this is a GOOD thing not a BAD thing as some would want you to believe....

Stick around, look around you after you read all of this mess look at http://pilotodyssey.com over 620 htm pages of friendly helpful info, I did all that to help people, its a positive thing, it has helped thousands it has saved people hundreds if not thousands of dollars, it has made peoples machines stronger, faster, more reliable, enjoyable, browse this message board, look at all the help and love no "Lackeys" here, look at all the ride trips and thousands of hours spent helping others, yeah "hoserite" is a bad thing, nice try Darkside mutts.

What ever happen to open and honest hard working businessmen?

Its easy for me to see what the ROOT CAUSE is, it all started when the customer didnt fully understand the instruction given and started asking questions.

I know we "hoserites" have failed the new people who migrate into the Pilot Odyssey community by not making it really clear what vendors to avoid I guess we need to work harder in the future, I don't know what to do at this point maybe we need to start a special category "Buyers / Seller Feed Back " "Perfered Vendor List" like so many other sites now have to assist its users in making the right choice when buying. Here is a HINT do you see the vendor in question posting on this site?

I am really sorry TurboTexas you had to go through all of this just to try and improve your hobby experience, I have no doubt you didnt expect to be treated like this by a company you tried to support with the purchase of their products, I am sorry your getting the blame for things you have no control over, if their is anything I or this group can do to help you finish or tune this mess just ask I am sure we can help some way or another.

A special thanks to all of those that have sent me emails about this subject.... As you know historically by sticking together we can only make the Pilot Odyssey world a better place in times like this.

Ok, I am new to this community, but this brings up a couple really important questions.

Are there Pilot/Odyssey online gangs? Am I in the right one? Do I get a jacket being a "hoserite"?

Very sorry you guys have trouble with a vendor.

Anyway, not trying to jump into the middle of something, just trying to ease some tension. Things get so out of whack sometimes through email and message boards because of the lack of tone and expression. Seen it too many times, it can get pretty ugly.

Smash

No wonder turbo need a break. If you need a bike let me now I lend ya one or help get your together. I bet we can have a cold one and laugh a little along the way. Turbo is fun to wrench with. Venders that's one that stick in my crow a little. It seams the new way of business today is find the chaepest supplier retail it out at a higher proffit and then blam each other( supplier and manfg and middleman ) and at the end comes down to owner( in this case turbo) holding the bag. I know form past experenses in my trade. This is also true. I been known to rip out the instalelled product and return it and replace at my own cost just to make it right because the supplier and middle man and manfg chased there tailes and would not fixit for the costomers. I many times ask myself why should I fix it the instlation was ok the product was bad. My dad told me something once that stuck." you only get one chace to make thing right and sometimes doing the right thing is more important than money and time" Thanks Dad it make me sleep easyier at night. Good luck turbo we don't need an upset trucker on the highway.

SmashSE,

If you don't already know about the jackets, what else don't you know about?

You've been clued into the secret handshake the first time you meet a member right?

It involves a desk and...........

http://web.archive.org/web/200101132254 ... Bishop.net

6 years ago, after i saw Aftershits.com early moronic attempts to help people it was obvious he didn't have a clue or even care whether he knew what kind of BS he was giving as help, not to mention his total refusual to even consider that he was wrong. After that I have no compassion for a guy willing to take advantage of our friends and talk like he knew when he didn't have a clue. Remember the .009 clearance? sad, very sad, whats even worse is that the VERY SAME people telling you to buy from the PO guy even if it cost more are do this to save theirselves $10.-20. or even more, they would never buy from LW unless they needed something only he had in stock or was going to get it at the dealer price from him anyway. But they are the first to tell you to "help a pooa brother out", instead of "go to blah blah blah and use my discount" like that would ever happen with them.

We helped Steve out just like we help (and in turn you all helped) others run, ride and repair their machines. Out of the 100s helped only a few have turned into a pos wannabe ody tycoon. I found dis heartening to see dave sifka compare what he offers to Livemutt, I respect Dave from what i have seen Dave is offering decent products in a narrow field of expertise which he is appearantly experienced in, Steve is a mutt that up until a few years ago KNEW NOTHING, now he is holding information hostage (that he gain here for free) providing it to those that pay him. What an ass, and carma is a bitch.

I am sorry but the link I posted seems to be inoperable so you the public cannot see the disturbing post from Mr Bishop.As a member here to this board I apologize for the posting of that link, it is a shame you can't see it.But I guess it may have been in the other boards administrators best interests to lock it up, 1 must be there own judge on this.

Well, it worked for me earlier today, so, if non-members are indeed locked out of viewing threads in this forum, there must be a darksider amongst us!

You mean that?

(above)

I was talking about this thread:

http://web.archive.org/web/200101132254 ... Bishop.net

Not the original.

I see Tripwire has deleted the contents of the "rant" post on the quickieracing board now.

"Andy/Kiowa had requested on his board that a line of posting stop on his board. The same request was made by several non-admin members. There were posts here that where posted before that request. They were, however, discovered by others after that request and seemed to fuel the fire on Kiowa's board. Therefore in the hope that this will help Kiowa's and the others request for it to end, I have removed the threads. This is Jeff/Atvnut's board, so he will have the final say. He is in the hospital right now. I made myself an administrator when I set the board up for him. He can decide when he gets back if I have overstepped my bounds. I'm sure he will be fine with it.

I plan on locking this thread as soon as I post it and later deleting it all together."

http://www.quickieracing.com/forums/ind ... topic=63.0

http://web.archive.org/web/200101132254 ... Bishop.net

WORKS for me....

http://web.archive.org/web/200104050951 ... t/350.html

I am now running .009" with Wiseco.

ROTFLMAO Dee Dee Dee

Yeah, I ASSumed that was the one he meant, my mistake.

Why would Kiowa ask that the threads from another board be removed and not remove the threads on the board he moderates?

Makes no sense!

Yes Hoser-exactly! that's the end of his rant on me, I guess Turbotexas displeasure of his purchase included me as well.I have not a clue what caused this posting from Mr Bishop about myself, to date as stated in my thread I havent posted 1 thing negative or positive about that second kit -so his motives for it are beyond my comprehension.

Why I found it so hard to understand why Steve at aftershot didn't call me last week when all this started just reminded me of the last time I tried to buy something from him... It was when Nuke'em and Hoser were in dumont dunes and I was delivering in Long Beach that thursday before they went back home... The week before When I booked the Load out of San Antonio I called EVERYBODY (ATVRacing, odysseysalvage.com and Steve Bishop (Professional Liar) and Socalgii and Works Shocks directly) in Hopes of finding a set of works shocks in stock that I would have had OVERNIGHTED to me for this trip. Again this is the nature of my job... I have little time at Home so when I want or need something I have to pay extra to get it before I leave out again!!!
Well when I got around to calling chucklenuts at aftershot motorspurts I talked to Ruby and she informed me they didn't have any in Stock, but that she would have some in "a few weeks". I then informed her that I wasn't willing to wait a "few weeks" and Thanked her for her time!!! I then called Works Placed my order, informed them I would be in town at the end of that week and ASKED nicely if they could possibly have a pair made by then... No Problem was the reply I mention every ones remarks about a few weeks to get them and they stated that was strange... well I no longer got off the phone with the fine folks at Works (approximately 10 minutes) and lo and behold Steve at chucklenuts at aftershot motorspurts motor (( Internal Combustion Engine ? )) sports calls me to inform me he had several pair ready that week, I told him that by the time he got them to MI and then to TX it would be to late for me to use. He then offered to Drop ship from works for an additional amount. (I don't remember 20.00 25.00 maybe??)
So why is it Steve can go out of his way to Offer such customer service before he gets my money, but refused to offer any kind of assistance after he was paid in advance!!!All the preceding mess because someone got his feelings hurt because I was in a hurry (part of the job story above) to have a few things explained to me on the $2700.00 product I had purchased... and then he has the nerve to infer I had lied to this group of Pilot-Odyssey Owners.
I am in the process of filing a complaint with the ripoff report website and his area's Better Business Bureau. I really do not want some other newbie to this fine sport to get taken advantage of!!!

I wouldn't give that guy the pleasure of you even knowing he exsists in this world. One day a horrible thing will happen to him for crimes commited against humanity, not that I wish it ( ;-) ) just because what comes around goes around. Turbo needs to get what he can out of him and then we need to send a 6'6" 280lbs black guy with a 9" thing that likes skinny little (Fat too!) Michigan punks and maks them call him "Daddy!"

In the mean time spreading the word about what a worthless piece of crap he and his customer support/products are needs to be on top priority. Anywhere he responds to some unsuspecting soul just getting into the Pilot/Odyssey world a link to his past achievements should be all that's needed to curb future sales. All with the wording, "You wanna be next?"

May his wife and kid love him less.

A simply disgusted and ashamed to have ever met him pilotodyssey.com member!

damn,let it go already,we have had to read all this shit for the last week and a half on all the different boards.Let it go, all of you on both sides have said enough.PLEASE

So, I see you'd rather live in a society where someone censors everything that's said so as to not offend anyone?

If someone wants to keep it going, that's their right, the board moderators can censor/delete/etc, that's their right and you can be offended/annoyed/perturbed/disturbed/whatever by it because that's your right.

I'll do whatever I want because that's my right and I respect other's rights to do whatever it is they please, even if I don't agree with it.

I agree but there is different ways like use there e-mail and discuss it or call them on the phone?I will speak my mind to anyone around and if they have a problem and want to step up to the next leval then I will go there also.I'm all for someone speaking there mind if they feel they have been delt with wrong.And the respect thing your talking about is 100% right but also respect that everyone doesn't want to hear your problems everyday.Alot of the guys on the sight were complaining and asking everyone to squash it,even the ones involved said that but then one of them start it all back up again.I also agree with you in that the sights need to be monitored and shouldn't let that stuff continue for as long as it did.I don't know any of the guys so I have no side to pick in the debate,I just think it's time to let it go and move on,or discuss it by some other means.I notice that alot of guys are quick to bash anymore,we are short in numbers anyways so we should try and keep it cool between everyone....

Wow, where did you get that?

I said the moderators have the right to censor, but I don't think they should.

Why would anyone want to squash this? Do we always have to be cheery and friendly towards one another?

I have more respect for someone willing to fight for what they believe than someone that wants to give up just to satisfy someone else.

I could care less what you think.

ody stable,do you race at all?I have family in Sandiego and race down there in Sanbernadino and Lake Elsinore but I don't ever remember your name coming up at all(screen name).I just wanted to know cause its a small world and wanted to see if I have met you before,i'm not thinking we have but just thought I would ask....

Nobody is FORCING these crybabies to READ what they are complaining about, by the time they start crying they know the players names, they see a post with a 'name' just skip over it, NO they cant they want to punish everybody, play GOD. FORCE others to give up their rights so they can get their way because they are too stupid NOT to read it, Pathetic

For those who do not want read about peoples problems with vendors or the like simply don't read these post.

This and other boards are here to spread helpful information so others to do not have to suffer the same results.

I totally agree with Hoser's statement that livewire really missed a golden opportunity to show that he stands behind each and every sale with good customer service. Instead we all witnessed quite the opposite that will surely be very detrimental to future sales from this vendor.

I could only hope that Steve will realise his mistake and do what needs to be done to get this matter quickly resolved for the benefit of both of them.

If not there are many who will step up to plate to to give aid to this fellow P.O. owner.

One of the many reasons I enjoy this sport.

Sicksand... only been a week... seems like a longer time to me also!!! But... I was told twice Steve would call me by his wife/business partner... I have phone records to prove this. LOOK at my first post... I only offered my phone # to Steve in case he left it at home!!! Look at the other boards, Mike's site and minibuggy.net... He is on line all day long!!! that's why I put my number out there... I expected him to call or email me with help... he has always replied quickly when I was wanting to buy something??? I have no idea WHY bugpac/buggy fabber started his crap, and I ignored his antics until he called me STUPID!!! Now if I was in Michigan I too would have punched him, and a few others!!! but since I am not (currently) able to so I stooped to their level and fought pack... m
My God he was even googling me ??? and found some gay guys site!!! (unless he had that site bookmarked!!! LOL)I don't recall anyone chastising him for his behaviour publicly...(I got lots of mail though)
please answer these 2 questions for me!!!

At what point did this become my fault?

At what point Did Steve finally interject his insinuation that I was a liar?